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 Post subject: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Sun Jul 28, 2013 11:59 pm 
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First of all, I would just like to say thank you to the team, version 4 seems to be exactly the kind of thing I was looking for.


Here are some small bugs I am experiencing with 3.90:

1. In Windows 8.1, there is a small bug with Metro apps. When you close an app and then open it with Classic Shell's metro menu, the app starts exactly where it left off rather then starting anew, as it does when launched from the start page. This only happens on 8.1. It's worth noting that 8.1 handles closing metro apps differently than 8.0, leaving them still open in a dormant state.

2. What may also be a potential bug is that I keep seeing the update icon beside the shutdown box on the start menu, this despite having all upates installed. Perhaps this is a bug with 8.1 itself and not the start menu?

3. A very tiny cosmetic issue with the Windows 8 skin for the Windows 7 style start menu. When clicking the shutdown button, the button box left to fade away is missing its right side.

Thanks for your time and a great program.


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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 1:05 am 
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1. You answered your question yourself. It is because Windows 8.1 handles closing of Metro apps differently than Windows 8. If you try to open them again from the Start screen, don't you see the same behavior? :) To truly close Metro apps in Windows 8.1 instantly, use Alt+F4. Or drag below and hold till they show their icon and then close.

2. Have you restarted after installing all updates and yet you see the icon? Until you restart, it will show that icon. You can turn off the display of that icon by opening settings and going to General Behavior tab, unchecking the option "Check for Windows updates on shutdown".

Also, is it possible that one or two optional updates or Windows Defender definition updates are not yet installed even if you restarted? Basically, if there are any pending updates, the icon will show. If your Windows Update settings are set to "Download updates but let me choose whether to install them" or "Install updates automatically", it shows.

3. Didn't understand. A screenshot explaining what you mean would help.

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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 1:57 am 
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GauravK wrote:
1. You answered your question yourself. It is because Windows 8.1 handles closing of Metro apps differently than Windows 8. If you try to open them again from the Start screen, don't you see the same behavior?

Nope, if I close them from the screen, they still appear as dormant processes in Process Hacker, (another truly great open source program,) but the difference is when they are launched. If launched via the start screen, they start fresh but when launched via CS, they resume where they left off.

GauravK wrote:
:) To truly close Metro apps in Windows 8.1 instantly, use Alt+F4. Or drag below and hold till they show their icon and then close.

Funny that you mention the drag and hold thing, I just found that out by accident and decided to come post it here. I was just dragging them off quickly before. The inconsistency with launching previously closed apps, (by quick drag down,) still happens but this takes care of it good enough for me.

GauravK wrote:
2. Have you restarted after installing all updates and yet you see the icon? Until you restart, it will show that icon. You can turn off the display of that icon by opening settings and going to General Behavior tab, unchecking the option "Check for Windows updates on shutdown".

I've discovered whats going on here. I have all updates installed and have restarted multiple times since then. It gets triggered when I open Win Update even though there are ONLY 3 optional updates listed. This behavior is incorrect for optional updates and furthermore, even if it wasn't, It should only show beside the shutdown button when there is a pending restart from updates that require it after they have been installed, not when there are optional or even important updates that have not been touched yet.

GauravK wrote:
Also, is it possible that one or two optional updates or Windows Defender definition updates are not yet installed even if you restarted? Basically, if there are any pending updates, the icon will show. If your Windows Update settings are set to "Download updates but let me choose whether to install them" or "Install updates automatically", it shows.

Only the optionals, (no defender updates,) which are drivers that I don't want right now but don't want to hide off the list just yet. These wouldn't exactly constitute pending updates since I have not selected to install them, which is what the shutdown update icon is for.

My setting is "Never check for updates", I like to do it manually and not be bothered to do it otherwise.

GauravK wrote:
3. Didn't understand. A screenshot explaining what you mean would help.

It happens right after clicking shutdown so getting a shot is impossible unless I can time it right shutting it down in VMware, while taking a shot with the host OS. I'll try to get something decent to post. It's really a tiny, minor thing though.


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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 2:49 am 
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There. I Used VMware and some video programs I've never heard of before to make the gif. As you can see, the right side of the rectangle is missing after the click.


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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 8:25 am 
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1. Give me an example for a specific app that has this behavior. On my WinRT 8.1 tablet I see IE opening the last session regardless how I launch it or close it. This is different from how it worked with 8.0.

2. Go to the folder %APPDATA%\ClassicShell and look for a file StartMenuLog.txt. Attach it here.


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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 12:27 pm 
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Ivo wrote:
1. Give me an example for a specific app that has this behavior. On my WinRT 8.1 tablet I see IE opening the last session regardless how I launch it or close it. This is different from how it worked with 8.0.

Run the PC Settings app for example, and go to a page other then the top one that it launches on, do a quick drag down to close it. (not the prolonged drag down that rotates the tile showing the icon, that one will definitely close it all. Now try launching it again from the start screen, it will do the flippy animation and start the program back from the top but if you once again select another page, quick drag down to close and then open it via CS, it will quickly appear, (minus the flippy animation,) and be exactly where it left off. Just tried it with the app "Notepad 8", same deal, type up a new doc, close via quick drag, re open via CS, it's where it left off, close the same way, open from start screen, fresh start.


Ivo wrote:
2. Go to the folder %APPDATA%\ClassicShell and look for a file StartMenuLog.txt. Attach it here.

Here you go:


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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:32 pm 
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The question is whether this is a bug or a feature. :D Meaning it is remembering the state of the app if it's not closed which is the new Windows 8.1 way. And if it's closed by holding it down for a longer time till the flip animation occurs, then it opens as before.

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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:45 pm 
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According to the log file, there shouldn't be an icon for Updates. At the time you grabbed the log, was the icon shown?


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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:52 pm 
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I actually like this now that I've gotten used to differentiating between the two close methods. Thing is, it only "remembers" where it left off with CS, yet not with the actual start screen. :P

With Start screen:
normal close: forgets
wait for flip: forgets

With CS screen:
normal close: forgets
wait for flip: remembers

It's like CS does it right and Windows itself, doesn't. I'll just assume it's a bit wonky since 8.1 isn't done yet and see what happens when it is done.


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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:54 pm 
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Ivo, I can't remember, I'll make a new one with it showing. All I have to do is open Win update and not install anything. Not exactly how Win7 had it.


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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:57 pm 
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When I hover over the Shutdown icon, it still says "Update and Shutdown" even though I didn't select any updates to be installed and all auto downloading and installing is off.


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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:03 pm 
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I see. I am looking at this registry value: HKLM\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\WindowsUpdate\Auto Update\UAS\UpdateCount.
Looks like it is 1 at this time, which I believe means Windows Update has 1 pending update. At least that's how it works on Windows 7. Things may have changed on 8.1.
If you select "Update and Shutdown", does it actually install anything?


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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:08 pm 
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Nope, doesn't install anything. That one update is available, its a defender definition update but I did not select it to be installed. If I install it, I still get the icon showing up, possibly due to 3 optional drivers being on the list of available but not selected to be installed.

It's like the icon mistakes available updates for 'installed pending restart' updates.


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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:15 pm 
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I guess I can remove this check for Windows 8 and use other means for detecting updates.


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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:17 pm 
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Yep, It's different on 7, I actually have to install updates for it to show up, it works properly. I'll try 8.0, now, (VMware is invaluable for testing things.)

Edit: It's only 8.1, probably worth waiting 'till the RTM comes out in less then a month.


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 Post subject: Re: Some small bugs
PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 2:46 pm 
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I don't use Windows 8. I'm reading this just for interest, and I'm unclear about one item.

—The available Microsoft updates, optional and otherwise, normally can be right-clicked one at a time and thence marked as "Don't show this update again" or something like that. But MS's wording isn't quite precise. When the user checks the box, it seems to convey a stronger message than Microsoft would suggest in removing the update from the user's list.

So, with the snag detailed in Windows 8.1 for Classic Shell, the user says, "I did not select it to be installed…" Fine. But, more than simply not selecting it, he HAS indeed checked the respective "Don't show" box beside the unwanted updates (on his Microsoft Updates website list)—correct?


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